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| Neutral Density FiltersFor effects on waterfalls | Rate Topic |
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| Posted by Robert: Tue Aug 9th, 2016 15:50 | 1st Post |
| Interested in thoughts on ND filters for making the long exposure water flow effects for waterfalls and waves/water current patterns. When I was on Skye I visited the Glen Brittle waterfalls briefly. I tried to make some photo's of the classic flowing water which are made with long exposures. It was a bright day and despite turning the ISO to LO and closing the aperture to minimum, the shutter speed was still way too fast to get the creamy classic water flow effect you so often see. I am assuming the only way, apart from waiting for the light to diminish is to use an ND filter to allow a much slower shutter speed. How many stops are needed to get a reasonable effect? I have looked on eBay  and there are variable filters available very cheaply and also cheap sets of various densities. The adage of never putting cheap glas in front of expensive glass comes to mind. I look at various 'proper' camera shop websites and find the prices of these ND filters are nearly as much as the lens... Certainly a set of two or three filters would come close to the price of a lens and there don't seem to be any variable filters. I understand the variable filters use two polarising filters stacked and work in tandem by rotating one filter a quarter turn to go from brightest to darkest.In a sense two polarisers would be better value because you not only get a variable ND filter but also a polariser (or two!) into the bargain. Thoughts and or suggestions please. This is for the D3 btw, 77mm filter size, which would allow use on almost all my lenses, via adaptors.
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by jk: Tue Aug 9th, 2016 18:59 | 2nd Post |
| I have a couple of the variodensity filters but I have found they cause colour tints to the image. Tint varies by make. The individual resin/glass filters from Lee or Hitech seem to work better but they can i duce tints as well under some conditions. Many landscape photograpkers seem to have a set of ND filter that range -2, -3, -4, -6, -10 stops. I have the Lee Little Stopper -8 stops and Hitech -10 stop ND filters. They seem to work OK for me when I need them. These ND are also useful if you want to use flash and balance with daylight but for me I prefer to use HSS for this but it does also have limitations.
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| Posted by Eric: Wed Aug 10th, 2016 03:59 | 3rd Post |
| Well I suppose I haven't mentioned this for like 10 years but I am STILL surprised manufactures haven't found a way to incorporate ND filtration in the camera. I for one would have loved a feature where you adjust the command dial to vary intensity and the rear rocker to position it (ie in the case of a graduated effect). I am sure there is some technical obstacle to this idea....why else would they not include such a valuable tool in its pro cameras?
____________________ Eric |
| Posted by Eric: Wed Aug 10th, 2016 04:02 | 4th Post |
Robert wrote:Interested in thoughts on ND filters for making the long exposure water flow effects for waterfalls and waves/water current patterns. I would try polarisers first. ND don't deal with reflections, which can be detracting when shooting water in the sun.
____________________ Eric |
| Posted by highlander: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 14:15 | 5th Post |
| I have tried a number of ND filters and quality is highly variable. For really long exposures you really start to get problems with colour castes and even rainbow effects. I bought one from SRB to go in their PRO holder and it was horrendous. Give them their due, I sent a sample image and they sent me a new filter. They think the problem was due to leaking from the gasket which cuts the light out. Taking this into consideration, I wondered why Lee filters don't appear to have gaskets but their Big Stopper is famous (and hideously expensive). From experience on two lenses, of two filter threads, and using both Fuji and Nikon cameras and lenses, the only ones I have not had any colour castes or had to make any corrections to are screw threaded Hoya ND1000 ones. I now have a 72mm one and several stepping rings to accommodate the smaller lenses. I have been very pleased with the results to date. I use an app on my iPhone to calculate the exposure and switch to manual focus before adding the filter (you can't see through it and neither can your camera's autofocus!)
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| Posted by amazing50: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 15:56 | 6th Post |
| I have an 82mm variable ND and rings for using it on various lenses. Don't use it too often but it can be handy. As with most filters tests show a decrease in sharpness, but when you're after a blurry effect it doesn't really matter.
____________________ There is nothing worse than a sharp image of a fuzzy concept ;~) Mike Grace |
| Posted by Gilbert Sandberg: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 16:10 | 7th Post |
| Robert, Another two cents... In my view (and dollar for dollar, or whatever currency...) a person is better off with a single (e.g. mid ND range) fixed filter (and maybe some step-rings for smaller lenses). Variabe filters (especially the cheap ones) have one guarantee that is not mentioned on the package: a disappointment. Robert, re: you adjust the command dial Most modern cameras have an ISO dial. Regards, Gilbert
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| Posted by Eric: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 16:17 | 8th Post |
Gilbert Sandberg wrote:Robert, Sure ...upwards but not down far enough. If we could dial in ISO 25 or lower...we wouldn't need an ND. 
____________________ Eric |
| Posted by highlander: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 16:41 | 9th Post |
| I'm sure my Fuji had a built in one, or rather a setting which effectively did what Eric suggests.
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| Posted by highlander: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 16:46 | 10th Post |
| Just checked, the X100 has a built in polymer filter that goes between the shutter and the rear element somehow. Not a setting then, but an actual filter. I think it's only 2 stops but it was useful in very bright light
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| Posted by Gilbert Sandberg: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 17:25 | 11th Post |
| Eric, re: If we could dial in ISO 25 Oh my, back to Kodachrome days.... Regards, Gilbert. PS the point I tried to emphasise, is that most fixed ND filters will be better (by sharpness and color) than most vari-filters at a similar price level.
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| Posted by amazing50: Fri Aug 12th, 2016 23:31 | 12th Post |
You could try one of the Mylar ones astronomers use, they reduce about 22 stops.
____________________ There is nothing worse than a sharp image of a fuzzy concept ;~) Mike Grace |
| Posted by Robert: Sat Aug 13th, 2016 02:19 | 13th Post |
amazing50 wrote:You could try one of the Mylar ones astronomers use, they reduce about 22 stops. And there was me thinking astronomers wanted more light, not less? Thank you all for what has turned into a very helpful thread, sorry I haven't 'got involved' but I have had my computer to bits fitting an SSD. Will tell you all about it ASAP. Very exciting! Actually it's still in bits but sort of jury rigged with bits of string and chewing gum!!!
____________________ Robert. |
| Posted by Eric: Sat Aug 13th, 2016 06:14 | 14th Post |
highlander wrote:Just checked, the X100 has a built in polymer filter that goes between the shutter and the rear element somehow. Not a setting then, but an actual filter. I think it's only 2 stops but it was useful in very bright light Yes you are right ...I had forgotten that feature. Good old Fuji. Now if only they could match Nikon camera response times I might be persuaded not to sell my gear.
____________________ Eric |
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