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| Early today. Z7ii and Z6ii | Rate Topic |
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 03:25 | 1st Post |
| Nikon released information on the new Z7ii and Z6ii very early this morning. Essentially some internal tweaks and upgrades and an extra processor makes the cameras faster. Plus for the paranoid users there is a second UHS-II SD card slot. More info here. https://www.dpreview.com/news/9554068841/nikon-z6-ii-and-z7-ii-boast-dual-processors-and-gain-a-second-card-slot
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 05:04 | 2nd Post |
| If you want extra power and duration for time-lapse, video the new MB-N11 battery pack will be a must have item. https://www.nikonusa.com/en/nikon-products/product/power-packs/mb-n11-power-battery-pack.html#tab-ProductDetail-ProductTabs-Overview
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 05:07 | 3rd Post |
| I have to ask the question to myself. Do I want this upgrade to my Z7. Yes some of the new features will be nice to have but I would want to use the Z7ii to see if they have fixed some of the annoyances on the Z7 e.g. the need to change both release mode and exposure bracketing settings to get a full exposure range set. However the updates are very much like the 's' updates in D2, D3 and D300 models. Non-essential for most users but a must-have if it fixes a big annoyance.
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| Posted by Eric: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 06:17 | 4th Post |
jk wrote:I have to ask the question to myself.How many exposures have you taken on your Z7? It may be indicative as to whether you are getting enough use out of it to warrant an upgrade. Since getting the D850 and reassessing my own photography 'needs and habits' I have come to the realisation that any other camera would sit on the shelf 99 times out of 100....so why buy something with that prospect? For me at least, the days of having a camera and lens for every eventuality have gone. Having a camera and lens collection that satisfies even 80% of my needs is good enough. I have always been a minimalist. 😆. We have a saying in our house “ we much prefer it's space to it's company†When lightroom came out and enabled sorting 'by focal length', I discovered 95% of my photography was using 2 zoom lenses. So I sold the rest. It's true I have bought (and sold again) new cameras & lenses, but I have never had to re-buy a camera or lens I got rid of. So I sort of regard that as a correct action plan.
____________________ Eric |
| Posted by chrishamer: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 07:25 | 5th Post |
| It's certainly interesting, I've ordered the Z6 mk II - the Z7 isn't as good for video so sticking with the Z6 series... I've ordered it from Amazon so I can decide if it's worth the upgrade or not - their returns are a lot more flexible than some other retailers... even though I loathe not to support my local camera store... The MB-N11 though... £360 is outrageous...
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 08:19 | 6th Post |
Eric wrote:How many exposures have you taken on your Z7? It may be indicative as to whether you are getting enough use out of it to warrant an upgrade.I understand your thought process but not an ethos I follow. The second hand value of cameras is very poor (1/3-1/4 of purchase price after 2 years) and the resale price in second hand market by dealers is hugely inflated (~twice the purchase in trade-in or more). On that basis I prefer to just keep and reuse as appropriate. So my D3S can now be used for portraits and some general work and copying of negatives and prints, as 12MP is sharp enough. My Fujis tend to have very low second hand value so I just keep and convert to IR or Full Spectrum use. Lenses are difficult. They are once again purchased low by dealers and sold high. I have seen a friend's long telephoto lens that he sold for £550 then sold on by a dealer for £1300. This is a nice profit for the dealer! So my view is I sell to people I know at a reasonable price which is lower than the cost of second hand purchase and more to me than a dealer would give me. At this stage the dead money is not an issue as it is spent money and the trade-in money is coppers!
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 08:22 | 7th Post |
chrishamer wrote:It's certainly interesting, I've ordered the Z6 mk II - the Z7 isn't as good for video so sticking with the Z6 series... I've ordered it from Amazon so I can decide if it's worth the upgrade or not - their returns are a lot more flexible than some other retailers... even though I loathe not to support my local camera store...Will be interested to see your YouTube report and comparison. I agree the MB-N11 is horribly priced! Too expensive. The Meike version will be out next year and be £100 and it is less well built but probably that makes no difference unless you need the battery grip for everyday use.
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| Posted by Eric: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 09:11 | 8th Post |
| jk wrote: I understand your thought process but not an ethos I follow. The second hand value of cameras is very poor (1/3-1/4 of purchase price after 2 years) and the resale price in second hand market by dealers is hugely inflated (~twice the purchase in trade-in or more). On that basis I prefer to just keep and reuse as appropriate. So my D3S can now be used for portraits and some general work and copying of negatives and prints, as 12MP is sharp enough. My Fujis tend to have very low second hand value so I just keep and convert to IR or Full Spectrum use. Lenses are difficult. They are once again purchased low by dealers and sold high. I have seen a friend's long telephoto lens that he sold for £550 then sold on by a dealer for £1300. This is a nice profit for the dealer! So my view is I sell to people I know at a reasonable price which is lower than the cost of second hand purchase and more to me than a dealer would give me. At this stage the dead money is not an issue as it is spent money and the trade-in money is coppers! I agree it is 'yesterday's money'. But I hate to see stuff sitting idle. I guess that's my peculiarity? (Or one of them ) I've always regarded money as a 'lubricant to life'. So adding a few drips back (trade in or resale) into the purchasing programme makes the next purchase a little let painless. I see no difference in letting something sit devaluing for years and years, to a dealer capitalising on your decision to divest....you still lost a % of the investment. The difference is that if you do it sooner than later, the % you get still has buying capacity. Of course it's better if you can sell to a friend or a private sale. Dealers have to make a living to be there to sell you new stuff. I don't see them as the devil incarnate for wanting to make a profit. You could arguably hold the view that the manufacturers are the real bandits, over charging for the equipment in the first place. It gives resellers lots more headroom for good quality used items. I've rarely bought equipment in the first wave. Buying new, 12-18months after release, significantly reduces the cost to a more palatable level ...and the technology is still leading. It just needs suppression of the urge to buy now......easy for a Yorkshireman.
____________________ Eric |
| Posted by chrishamer: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 09:46 | 9th Post |
Eric wrote:jk wrote: I agree it is 'yesterday's money'. But I hate to see stuff sitting idle. I guess that's my peculiarity? (Or one of them ) ------------------ Just to wade in here (sorry) I think both your arguments are valid. I sit between both to be honest, if I find I'm not using lenses I tend to sell and either save it for future purchases or change to something different. Bodies are harder, I tend to shift them quicker as the value drops faster - as jk pointed out. Though if I stick with the Z6 II, I'll probably sell my Z6 as it is for around £1000-£1100, which isn't bad given I bought it used with the FTZ and 24-70 F4 for £1800 and I'd keep the adapter and lens - I lucked out in that it still has a john lewis warranty till may which some buyers will value. I'm not sure I'd be quite as tempted to old bodies, the only one I regret selling was my D1, but that's purely sentimental.
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| Posted by chrishamer: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 09:48 | 10th Post |
jk wrote:Will be interested to see your YouTube report and comparison.Yeah I don't get it on the MB-N11, it feels like Nikon are really saying, 'you wanted that grip so bad, no bloody pay for it' And thanks, if I receive it on Nov 5th (Amazon seems to think so but the TC 2.0X Z is now 2 months late) I'll have something up within a week I reckon. Then follow up with something more in-depth by December ish
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 11:21 | 11th Post |
chrishamer wrote:
I dont think that there is a right/wrong way just what suits you best. I have multiple 105mm lenses for my Nikons. A 105mm f1.8 Ai, 105mm f2.8 Mikro VR AFS, 105mm f2.8 Mikro AFD, and the 105mm f2.8 non-Ai. I had to throw out the oldest 105mm f2.8 recently in Spain and that really upset me but it had become corroded internally and had seized so the focus would not turn. It always used to work so well. I had bought it as my first Nikon telephoto in 1973. Yes I sold my D1 to get my D1X. I still regret it but looking back the D1X was a much better camera. It had many extra features and no magenta cast. It was one of the reasons I did the project of working out how to re-cell the EN4 batteries so I could keep my D1X running along side my D2X.
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| Posted by GeoffR: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 11:46 | 12th Post |
| The updates certainly justify the waiting by those who want mirrorless but weren't entirely convinced by the Z6/Z7. With the new grip it looks a lot more suitable in terms of size but I get the impression that Nikon are marking time until an entirely new, upgraded, body comes out. I have seen rumours of a Z8 and Z9 which look impressive and more what I would want, add-on battery grips really don't do it for me, they make the camera bigger and more comfortable to use but, with a few exceptions, they look like an after thought. The MB-N11 certainly looks like an after thought, it actually sticks out on the left (from behind). I'm far from sure that Nikon know where they are going with the Z6/Z7, the Z8/Z9 looks like a finished design but the Z6/Z7 looks as though it was designed by a committee. The latest versions do appear to have been produce in response to user/potential user feedback which is good. I would still like to see a FTZ II adaptor, without the tripod socket but with a focus motor for AF lenses. A version without the focus motor would be good too, I really don't see the point of the tripod socket where there is a grip on the camera. The other design feature that I don't like is the command dial sitting on the top plate, it looks dated; it is dated they did it that way on the F90. The command and sub-command dials on the D3. D4, D5 and D6 are slanted for ergonomic reasons but those on the Z series, so far, aren't. I don't understand why, if so much research went into the alignment of the dials for the DSLRs, it has been ditched for mirrorless.
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| Posted by jk: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 12:17 | 13th Post |
GeoffR wrote:The updates certainly justify the waiting by those who want mirrorless but weren't entirely convinced by the Z6/Z7. With the new grip it looks a lot more suitable in terms of size but I get the impression that Nikon are marking time until an entirely new, upgraded, body comes out.I never noticed the slope of the D850, D500, D3, D3S, D4, D5 command dials that you mentioned. I dont find the horizontal dials of the problem on Z7. Just shows that some things are so natural that they go unnoticed. Waiting for that FTZ II adapter as I really want to use some of my older lenses with screwdriver AF drive. The tripod foot is such a nuisance and makes it cumbersome. I cant see why a person would use the tripod foot on the FTZ rather than the camera body or lens. If it is a long telephoto then the lens is the best counterbalance point. For a lighter lens or short zoom then the body works best. Nikon seem to be making very strange design decisions these days.
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| Posted by chrisbet: Wed Oct 14th, 2020 17:04 | 14th Post |
jk wrote:I had to throw out the oldest 105mm f2.8 recently in Spain and that really upset me but it had become corroded internally and had seized so the focus would not turn. It always used to work so well. I had bought it as my first Nikon telephoto in 1973.Well that is where I go one step beyond in terms of keeping old equipment - I'd have dismantled and resurrected it if it was possible!
____________________ If it is broken it was probably me .... |
| Posted by jk: Thu Oct 15th, 2020 03:08 | 15th Post |
chrisbet wrote:Well that is where I go one step beyond in terms of keeping old equipment - I'd have dismantled and resurrected it if it was possible!  I was in Throw out or Keep mode.
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| Posted by chrishamer: Thu Oct 15th, 2020 09:50 | 16th Post |
| Back on topic slightly, :-P just got confirmation from Nikon that the MB-N10 will work with the Z6 II which was unclear so far, so I'm quite pleased I won't need to keep the MB-N11 if I don't like it.
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| Posted by jk: Thu Oct 15th, 2020 11:52 | 17th Post |
chrishamer wrote:Back on topic slightly, :-P just got confirmation from Nikon that the MB-N10 will work with the Z6 II which was unclear so far, so I'm quite pleased I won't need to keep the MB-N11 if I don't like it. And/But the MB-N11 will NOT work with the Z7 and Z6 as the extra contacts are not there in the body.
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| Posted by chrishamer: Thu Oct 15th, 2020 13:40 | 18th Post |
| Yep that's the one, I'm fine with that though, I'm fine with the MB-N10
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| Posted by GeoffR: Thu Oct 15th, 2020 14:23 | 19th Post |
jk wrote:And/But the MB-N11 will NOT work with the Z7 and Z6 as the extra contacts are not there in the body.Sounds exactly the same as was the case with the F90 and the MB10, the additional shutter release only worked with the F90X. There was a repairer who would modify an F90 so that the shutter button on the MB10 worked with it. It might have been reasonable to expect Nikon to have learned from the F90/F90X experience but clearly they didn't.
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| Posted by chrishamer: Fri Oct 16th, 2020 11:46 | 20th Post |
GeoffR wrote:Sounds exactly the same as was the case with the F90 and the MB10, the additional shutter release only worked with the F90X. There was a repairer who would modify an F90 so that the shutter button on the MB10 worked with it.I think this is a whole other ****up to the F90X... it's more of a case of WHY on earth the Z6 / Z7 didn't have the contacts in the grip to begin with... they've made so many lovely solutions in the past such as the style for the D300, D600 etc. The Z6 II / Z7 II both have the contacts inside the battery compartment... it was a stupid omission on the original Z6 / Z7 and seems VERY stupid to have been left out.
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| Posted by jk: Fri Oct 16th, 2020 11:52 | 21st Post |
| Got to agree with both GeoffR and Chrishamer. Mega ****up by Nikon. I will be contacting Nikon UK to complain and ask if there is a *Free* Z7 upgrade to allow MD-N11 to be used. I wont be buying more stuff from them in future. I have enough kit anyway.
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| Posted by GeoffR: Fri Oct 16th, 2020 11:57 | 22nd Post |
jk wrote:Got to agree with both GeoffR and Chrishamer.I have to agree, if I had bought a Z7 I would want to be able to use a control grip with it once such a thing was released.
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